Thursday, July 27, 2006

Code Musings

A couple of years ago one of my new neighbors then next block over started to put a chain link fence. I went over to let him know about the restrictions on chain link fences in front yard to save him time and money. He got pissy on me. Although I could have just let him stew in his own mess, instead I went to his direct neighbor whom I knew and asked them to talk to him to explain I was trying to save him grief. I did feel like telling him to screw it.

Picket fences work fine for front yards. Mine keeps my dogs in.

Do you plan to do something to your house? Don't be stupid. Find out if you are allowed to do what you are trying to do. Get the permit if you need one. This is not Idaho or Montana, where zoning does not exist.

Sometimes I find the people who are the pissiest are the ones who know they were in the wrong.

A few years ago one of my other neighbors called animal control on a neighbor whose dogs were always getting getting loose and whose dogs barked all the time, making it difficult for that neighbor to rest. Apparently they also did not have county tags and shots. They got all pissy and came over accusing us of calling animal control. 1st we did not do it. 2nd they knew their dogs were problems and did not take care of it. Many neighbors told them their dogs were loose and gave then ideas who to take care of it. They never did. It finally took animal control coming over to take care of it.


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51 comments:

Flyer anon said...

"This is not Idaho or Montana, where zoning does not exist."

Do you know that as a fact or is it just another unfounded assumption?
I lived in Billings Mont. for 2 years (79-81) I'd guess the city had codes even back then, one thing it didn't have was ppl with over active narc glands.
The ppl there were the most open minded and tolerant I've ever met anywhere and I'd still be there if the winters weren't so brutal.
I tell ppl that if Koresh went to Mont. Instead of Waco Texas he'd still be alive today.

"Picket fences work fine for front yards. Mine keeps my dogs in'.

You've posted pics of your dogs so we know what you have to keep in the yard the times you let em' out of the house. I like em' larger, healthier, and more intimidating. They stay outside 24/7 unless it gets real cold. I keep em' for protection, not companionship. The way I look at it they're protecting their territory and each other, I just happen to live inside of it.(plus I'm the one that feeds em' each morning which gives em' a reason to look out for me)

Wood fences rot, need painting, and feed termites. Chain link has none of those problems.
While we're regressing in products available how bout' we all go back to clay sewer pipe and 2 pronged electrical outlets

Anonymous said...

Chain link fences look like crap, why anyone would ever want them in their yard is beyond me. Yeah they may not rot but they do rust. Tetnus shot anyone?

Janet Reno said...

Your ignorance is quite impressive Flyer Anon. You complain about code enforcement which goes hand-in-hand with improving the quality and by proxy the safety of the neighborhood , yet you obviously feel so unsafe in your neighborhood, in it\'s current state, that you require guard dogs. The folks in Montana and Idaho are, in general, neither open-minded or tolerant, they tend to rugged individualists who usually want to be left alone. A fair number of them also think that taxes are unconstitutional and that they should have the right to secede. Perhaps if you left your Mt Carmel enclave occasionally you\'d know that there are quite a number of options for picket fences that are not wood, but composites that are quite weather resistant.

Flyer anon said...

Gee Janet when were you living there?
Or is your opinion another unfounded one like Scotts?

Anon 4:18
Can you say 'Galvanized'?
Another invention of modern technology.
That's why they DON'T rust.
Years from now when I don't need dogs to prevent B&Es I may pull mine down, untill then....

Anonymous said...

The chain link fence - the height of modurn teknologee.

Anonymous said...

Hey UnaFlyerbomber, move back to Montana where you can surround your log cabin with chain link fence so you and your dog pals can quietly work on your manifesto.

Flyer anon said...

Billings is flooded by tourists from around the world and country during summer as Yellowstone and the Grande Tetons are on the ‘must see' list for anyone doing the US tour. It has the only airport to get in and out of and is the largest city for 500 miles. They didn't have a rodeo drive but it was damn fun on a Sat. nite in July.

RubyRidge said...

http://www.greatdreams.com/freeidaho.htm
We
Aint
Coming
Out
to
What
A
Cook
Out

Flyer anon said...

While I didn't ask and wasn't fitting the stereotype anyway, A Montanan as ignorant as you Janet and anon 4:40 would be expected to assume all Floridians are ‘Dukes of Hazard' red necks that wrestle alligators.

Flyer anon said...

And belong to the KKK...

Don\'tTreadOnMe said...

I am ever more impressed with your complete lack of rational thinking. Perhaps if you removed your head from you posterior and actually read the post, the first part was actually complimentary and very accurate, a rugged individualist is not at all derogatory, if you had actually lived there instead of just resided there, and met anyone from the area, perhaps you\'d know yourself, oh but again, that would require the formulation of actual thought. Most westerners, particularly those from the mountain states pride themselves on that pioneer spirit. The second part of the statement was actually qualified by the phrase \"a fair number.\" Maybe where you were raised a fair number meant \"all\", I don\'t know. Because of the wide open land with sparse population, and little oversight by authorities, the western states attract quite a number of the isolationist sort. Your claims about Billings are both quite antiquated and irrelevant if you actually think that you could reside in the town limits and not be required similar standards of upkeep.

Flyer anon said...

"think that you could reside in the town limits and not be required similar standards of upkeep"
DUH...
Scott said they didn't exist, I said in the city they probably did.

"rugged individualist"? I didn't consider it derogatory, it's something ALL residents there are proud of.
Here if you say your ancestor fought in the civil war you'll be one upped by someone saying their ancestor came over with DeSoto. That's the level of "Who beat who here first" mentality in this state. Up there staying through the winter determined residency.

"if you had actually lived there instead of just resided there, and met anyone from the area."
JUST RESIDED!, MET ANYONE FROM THE AREA!
2 years ain't just a weekend stay. Being someplace 2 years allows one to become intimate in a way that's more than a meeting. You done 2 northern rocky winters?
Ever listen to the ‘Radio Nation' program on WMNF hosted by Laura Flanders? She was broadcasting from Mont. A few weeks back a really went ape over how progressive Montana was. Maybe that's why so many Hollywooders buy land there instead of Idaho or Utah

"antiquated and irrelevant"?
I dare say it's (Billings) probably more cosmopolitan now then it was even back then. Bet they get broadband just like us

Flyer anon said...

To anaon 4:18

" Chain link fences look like crap,(to you) why anyone would ever want them in their yard is beyond me."

Maybe because most ppl look at the world pragmatically and functionally instead of through the eyes of a florist or interior decorator

Flyer anon said...

For Scott,

A little something you can do to get your journalism wings.
Go over the SECH membership, about 150.
See how many of them were here 20+ years against 10- years.
Cross reference those against citation and compliance.
I'd bet the 20+ers did it over duress rather than enthusiasm.
The place may look prettier but you've left a lot of PO'd ppl
The investors are selling their last house at a loss and are gonna' split and no longer be of support.
What happens then?


I know you start topics to goad, in fact I like it.
But please be objective to my points or I'll quit playing the game.

Anonymous said...

Who really care anymore.
The investors will come and buy up the land.
And to you they will say....go pack sand.

Flyer anon said...

I'm sorry, my mistake.
None of the cited 20+ers are gonna' be on the list of SESH members. They were to busy minding there own business to get involved in narcing out neighbors.

Flyer anon said...

Janet:you said:
"code enforcement which goes hand-in-hand with improving the quality and by proxy the safety of the neighborhood"

You rely on the proxy of code enforcement to make the place prettier and safer, I'll rely on cops with guns and my dogs for the safety of my house and belongings.

Anonymous said...

dearest kenny,

u r nuts. perhaps being an informed juror makes you superior to rest of us...or does that come from living in montana with the other free men/pseudo-militia wanna be's? please feel free to go back there whenever b/c we r tired of ur crap. dog, no dog, fence, no fence, ur still a tool.

Flyer anon said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Anonymous said...

why r u gonna bring ur gun next time? shut ur hole. where's that list??

Flyer anon said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Anonymous said...

um, kenny? i was born and raised here, too. what else ya got? interloper my ass. it's called change, perhaps you should get familiar with it. might i suggest u start with painting ur house? if u didn't live on a street that looks like beirut maybe u wouldn't b so angry.

Flyer anon said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Anonymous said...

wow! u couldn't be farther off base but nice to see ur tru colors. so pretty much all of ur crap u spew is b/c u hate gay people? why not just preface every message u post with "my name is kenny-flyer anon-ima hompophobe-antisocial buttwipe"? maybe next time ur neighbors won't miss when they throw those bricks or shoot at u. just b/c u put asterisks doesn't minimize the hatefulness of ur words. i'm sticking with my original assessment and again say, ur a tool. sleep tight...assh*le.

Anonymous said...

Not to break up a fine arguement but.... The house we bought in OSH has a chain link fence in the front and is not in the best shape making it even uglier. We have small dogs so replacing with a picket won't really work. I'd rather not have a fence at all. Does anyone have experience with removing a chain link fence? and/or installing an "invisible" fence to keep the pets in the yard?

Anonymous said...

It all goes back to what is legal according to city code. Why is that so difficult to understand. It is either right or wrong. I am a long timer here in the neighborhood and over the past 15 years I have remodeled my home board by board. As for the investors, I will be so happy when they pull out. They do half-assed work at remodeling and make the home look great. They then sell to unsuspecting people that move in and the entire house has to be remodeled correctly, or we look as a crap hole again. I would rather see owner occupants purchase the home and restore them correctly with quality work. Yes, Flyer anon, your street is one of the very worst streets in the neighborhood, is it because no one on the street takes pride, no one cares? You must also look at the crime stats of your street versus a McBerry. Is it worth living in fear and crime to keep the street down? I have heard so many times on this site about gentrification. I hate the phrase and how it is used. We all want a great quality of life. As a previous poster commented...it is called change. If you think the neighborhood has been bad to date, just wait. As gas prices continue to soar, more people will move into the inner city neighborhoods. These people will not tolerate the drug dealers, unsightly homes, etc. It will force people to raise their minimum standards of living. I honestly cannot see how anyone would support the way some of these neighbors live. Drive down some of the streets south of Osborne, between 12th and 15th. Many of these homes have small infants. How can that be safe. When you have crackhead parents, lazy unfit parents, how can you not want the government to step in to protect these childrens. Statistics show all across america that cleaner cities have less crime. If I were a City of Tampa official, I would be absolutely humiliated that Tampa has been on the Dirtiest city in America list. They have done absolutely nothing to clean this city. Tampa has always had the belief that if your are "poor" it is acceptable to live as you wish. I find that very offensive. To me that shows that they assume that poor people are lazy pigs that can't keep thier yard clean. There was an article in the Tampa Tribune this week discussing the Central Park tenants moving out into homes throughout the city. Mind you, these are people that have lived in the projects for most of their lives. Do you think for one minute that the city or Housing Departments spent one minute educating these people on the responsibilities that come with living in single family homes. Who do you think will keep the yards up? This will create more code problems. We have a code department that has been incompetent for too many years. We have a City leader afraid to make change. When we finally get an inspector that actually works, the city begins to tie her hands and create obstacles. While I do not support the "cookie cutter" style neighborhoods, I do want to live in a neighborhood that I know my property value will be protected, I do want to live in a neighborhood that I know will be safe for my children to play in. I do think it is fair that we expect each homeowner or renter to keep thier grass cut, etc. THIS IS COMMON SENSE! You drive down some of these streets and some of the properties are so bad you can't even see the homes. Who knows what rodents, snakes, etc are living in this. How would you like to live next to one of these and see the rats cross the street all night. Ugh! I don't believe that anyone is wanting to dictate what your house must look like. (Just look at their homes. Each one is beautiful, clean and unique) People automatically assume that since we are in America, it is a constitutional right to own a home. IT IS NOT! It is a privelege to own a home. Not all people are cut out to be home owners. Speaking for myself, I realize there may come a time that I may have to sell and not own real estate. It's a fact. If you are unable or unwilling to keep up your property to the city's minimum code standards, then maybe you too are no longer a good candidate for home ownership. I would bet that if you took some of these properties and placed them next to Pam Iorio or Curtis Lane's home, they would be brought to compliance within 2 weeks. All I can say Mr. Montana is careful what you wish for. You have already been shot on your beruit looking street, do you really want it to deteriorate more?

Anonymous said...

Amen Anon. However, the city and county officials have done something to clean up Tampa. Mayor Iorio accepted a $15,000 raise for her hard work. (When was the last time any of you got a raise of more than 10%) And Jim Norman got his pockets lined by those in Cheval so he would set aside 1 million dollars to build a fence. I know most political leaders are corrupt and have their agendas, but I am tired of all of these leaders ripping off the citizens to keep office. Look at the impact fees. $196... and people like Rhonda Storms refuses to raise them... and has the cuts to run for Senate. Meanwhile, you and I pay for schools to be built, even though many of us have no children. I know many of the neighbors have thier own opinion of Rose Ferlita, but at least she has steel balls to stand up and vote against most of this crap. The mayor, just like all of us knew what the job paid before accepting it. In my business, people doing the same thing in other cities get paid almost double, does that mean I should get a raise. To compare Tampa to Orlando and St. Pete Mayor's is absurd. One has nothing to do with the other. Here is something to research. Look at the time since Mayor Iorio took offie. During that time, find out what has happened to the city of Tampa Payroll. She has added so many layers and manager making above six figure salary. Who do you think is paying for this. Does anyone know what Curtis Lane makes annually? How many top officials have been added under her administration? I guarantee you, this would blow you away. David, why don't you put a pole on the site to see what her ratings would be in various areas, code, crime, neighborhoods, fiscal responsibility, then overall, etc. I think it may be an eyeopener. Our main problem is that so far, no one has stepped up to annouce they will run against her. Either that, or they are playing her game, wait til a few weeks before election, then announce you will run so no one will find out that there is no substance behind your platform, or better yet, you don't have to have a platform.

Bungalowlady said...

Anon 2:49 - When I read the article about Iorio's $15,000 raise, I almost fell off my chair. But, as I continued to read, I found out that the Mayor (whomever it has been) has not had a raise in 8 years. I would have quit way before 8 years passed. So, then I decided to find out what kind of an annual raise the $15,000 actually was. When you work it out it is about 1.32% per annum. I would quit over that too. The tachers complain that they only get 2-3% per annum. Everyone sympathizes with the teachers - raises too small. So, why is everyone complaining that the job of mayor will get a 1.32% per annum raise. Would you be happy with that kind of raise when the average annual ragte of inflation is 4.25%?

Anonymous said...

I know a lot of people that aren't going to vote for her.
An arrogant administration.
She won't change code and adds layers of managers and more directors with some of them making more than the mayor is making.
Did I forget to mention that they also get bonuses?
She has done everything to demean city employees. Cut pay, cut benefits, work harder, blah.
Heres some chump chang for all your hard work.
The police officers don't even speak to the retired police officers anymore.
When have they ever sued before?
She hates the city employees.
Why? I don't know.
They can only take so much before they will break.
Its like running water through a paper towel.
Before you expect any departments to get better, she is going to have to pay them a reasonable amount.
Until she does that, keep waiting for your services to get better.
They have no incentives to work harder.
None.

Anonymous said...

Oh please, do not buy into the 1.32% per annum. How many people have not gotten any raises in the past 5 years. How many people have lost thier jobs, business. You can't tell me that raises are a given. Typically, raises are granted based on performance. Not only the employees performance, but that of the business as well. Tampa is crying on how much in dept we are, how over budget we are, yet she get $15,000. I agree with the earlier post, lets see how much salary she has put on us tax payers. Evidently, Tampa can no longer afford her.

Resident Blogger said...

By the way Kenny, if you would do more than come to an association meeting and sit like a toad waiting to eat a fly, or like last time, stick your head in, look around and leave, you might have noticed that several of SESH 20 year plus neighbors are members and were in attendance. Your problem is you live here but that is all. You don't mix and every where you go you exude the “don’t mess with me” aura which precludes your making any friends and is also the theme of your frightfully ugly home. However, for you, the good news is there is no code against UGLY!

I hear Montana calling. Perhaps you should answer the call!

Flyer anon said...

OK, Next meeting come sit down and introduce yourself and talk to me.
We may actually get along, seems we both have like personalities.
I have far more respect for a principled adversary than a vacillating ally.
And I do have gay friends. ‘Friend' defined by when called on to help you reply "What do I do" as opposed to "What do you want me to do".

Maybe I can be part of the assoc. When you want to drag someone into the code system I'll volunteer to be the one to confront them personally on the problem before putting them thru the ringer

Come on Res-blog, take me up on the offer. After the next meeting I'll spring for a pitcher and pizza at Ybor's

Scott, I know you enjoy these spirited discussions as it keeps the hits counter clicking, and the rating for the blog up and the payback for the ads. But again, give me my due or I'll quit playing the game.

Anonymous said...

Rhonda Storms got steel balls? Do we have some hard evidence of this? Post the images!

I am surely glad I chose to live in the non-historical area of seminole heights. I chose it over the historical area so I wouldn't have to deal with the city. I didn't realize the residents are more viscious. We have no problems in my area. All the houses look good, and as far as I know, no b*tchy-a## neighbors.

I feel for the residents that have to put up with this crap.

Anonymous said...

Kenny,
We have found you a job.
You can help us clean up the city and I think we will all respect you more for volunteering instead of sitting on your duff complaining.
Anytime you see a pile of crud, please let them know it is unacceptable like Sherry does.
Sherry rarely complains on anyone and always tries to speak to the person first. Then calls code.
If they piss you off Kenny, stick code on em.
It makes everyone feel good in the end.
Signed,
Crazy and proud

Anonymous said...

"To anaon 4:18

" Chain link fences look like crap,(to you) why anyone would ever want them in their yard is beyond me."

Maybe because most ppl look at the world pragmatically and functionally instead of through the eyes of a florist or interior decorator"

To flyer anon
yes to me, chain link fences look like crap....and Im goin out on a limb here but I'm sure the majority of the neighborhood would agree with me. They do nothing to improve your property and lets face it, the houses that do want these types of fences are how shall i say it....less than par. You say the world looks at things pragmatically, well yes... so lets take any two house that are identical; one with a chain link fence and another with a picket fence. Which one do you think will sell.

Anonymous said...

Sure thing, Kenny, like anyone is going to walk up and introduce themselves to someone who comes in to a meeting after it has already started and leaves well before it is over. What, you want Sherry the President to stop the meeting when you walk in and acknowledge you? It's not AA, you know.

If you ever came before the meetings for that 30-45 minutes of mingling, you would get people to talk to you, lots of them. And even if you stuck around after the meeting, same thing.

But no, as usual, it's "poor Kenny, nobody likes him and won't talk to him". Well Waaaaaaahh Waaaaahhh for you. Stop being such a big baby and quit with the piss poor excuses. 'Cause you know what they say about excuses. Excuses are like assholes; everyones got one and they all stink. wipe yer butt and get over it allready. And you can quit playing the game whenever you want, we won't miss you. Maybe you can find some blog group from Montana, or blog among your fija buddies, where we're all sure you'll be much happier.

And to Scott
Thanks for deleting Kenny's markedly homophobic derrogatory posts. Pretty amazing fodder for someone who claims he never gets out of line. I think all the gay people should descend on Kenny's ugly house one night and paint it rainbow. At least Kenny's "gay friends" would then know that he's really sincere about calling them friends.
Signed,
Crazier Still

Anonymous said...

It is in violation 420-36DD for any assembled group of gay persons to afflict paint onto ugly houses that resemble a rainbow-type arrangement. This is a double violation for said incident to occur at night.

-Codeman

Anonymous said...

codeman ...

that sounds like my wife's bra size

Anonymous said...

I know.

-Codeman

Anonymous said...

OK who the heck is Kenny?

AngelSil said...

420-36DD

This implies a rather busty marijuana user =P

Resident Blogger said...

flyeranon....lets not forget how you got your name. Just where are those flyers? I have been at some of the meetings that you have attended. You are well known. Generally you make no attempt to speak with anyone, with the exception of calling people out, taking them to task, and then leaving. Other times you come in, sit like a stump and leave while the meeting is going on. The best was the last meeting when you came in prior to the meeting starting, looked around briefly and left. All of this behavior suggests an agenda NOT a desire to meet and get along with your neighbors.

IF you stayed, acted like someone who actually wanted to meet people and contribute to what is going on, more of people might give a darn about taking the time to know you.

As to the 20 plus and some feeling you seem to have that they are ignored. I don’t have the time or facility to accept the challenge you made to Scott about surveying the entire membership to determine the 20+ people, but I did a little investigating on my own. One of the 20 plus is on the association board. Another is just shy of that. That is two out of eight. As to the others, most have lived in the neighborhood from 3 to 10 years. So it is not exactly a group of interlopers! In addition the board is made up of gay, straight, white, black, Hispanic (Cuban and Mexican), young, old, single, and married neighbors. Most have lived in Tampa for a very long time and there is at least one native Cracker. Some are parents, some are not. So this does as well as can be done, by eight people, to represent the neighborhood.

Everything about this neighborhood is open to everyone . Numerous ongoing attempts are made to get people involved. I see it in the newsletter, on this blog, and on the SESH web site. Constantly information is sent out and constantly we are being asked to help. Some of us simply choose to live on the land, not in the neighborhood.

Lastly, dogs. I have dogs. They both guard for me and are my companions. I do not force them to stay outside in the rain and heat. I love them. I have a very hard time with people who treat dogs the same as they would a car. Feeding them does not make you any more than necessary to them. Kind of reminiscent of slaves, I should think.

Greg said...

Well said!

While OSHNA is not as lucky to have someone like flyer anon "attend" our meetings, one will find the diversity of the neighborhood represented on the board and the committee chairs is very similar - be it age/race/ length of time in the 'hood.

Both neighborhoods face the challange of involving the newbies and the long time residents in getting the word out about the good things that happen as a result of having an association and getting the word out regarding the opportunities that the neighbohood has for involvement and improvement.

Working together as a whole for neighborhood improvement and forward progress makes it better for all concerned in both neighborhoods (reference Hooker Patrol here).

I appreciate the efforts of those board members and committee chairs and volunteers in both neighborhoods - in fact I can feel the ripple effect of those positive forward looking activities right now. Sometime you just have to let those "positive personalities" like flyer anon go to do their thing. In time they either realize the positives happening in the area or move on to infect another location with their "can do " spirit.

Thanks for your efforts until you are better paid!

Anonymous said...

Here is the most important thing to take away.

If it weren't for the active, passionate people working their tails off in the neighborhoods, who would be here to protect the history and character of our historic neighborhoods? I can't imagine what Tampa would look like today if people would not have invested the time, energy and money into restoring and protecting the architectural gems. While people like Flyer Anon complain, look at thier homes. Destroyed beyond recognition, void of any character elements that made them a Bungalow. What a Shame!

Flyer anon said...

My house was never a bunglow. it was and is a shack. Anything I do only improves.

Anonymous said...

Oh yeah, and it's sooooo obvious how much you've done to improve it! Exactly what /anything/ have you done?

Anonymous said...

Hey now. Last time I walked by, it looked like all the appliances or vending machines were gone. That is an improvement.

Anonymous said...

Ever considered painting flyer? Landscaping would be a thought too.

Anonymous said...

Why should I improve my house Bungalowlady?
I am not blind, I know you typed that.

Resident Blogger said...

First off, you are wrong! Not Bungalowlady at all. Second of all you should improve because,,,,,,,,,
YOUR PLACE IS FREAKING UGLY AND DEPRESSING!

I am thinking that a normal human being with self respect has a desire to be both comfortable and proud of his/her surroundings. And that as a human being and member of the world family, they would have the desire to be a good neighbor and not live in an eyesore.

But some people, and you seem to be one, have a very distorted idea of self. They take pride in living to disturb rather than to contribute. Obviousoy Flyer, you would rather spend your energies to rub everyone the wrong way and be a thorn in everyones side rather than to join in, have friends in your surroundings, and be a good neighbor. You have some wierd idea that a good neighbor hides in his house and neither gives nor takes anything nor exchanges in any way with his neighbors.

Said it before. You are a perfect candidate for an island!

Anonymous said...

I know it was Bungalowlady or ppl like her.
I have plenty of records.
Just wait.